If anyone is interested

sb1227 · Post by **sb1227** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 4:17 pm

Ok, here's the deal. I've been fighting Montipora Nudibranchs for a few months now. Generally people notice them first on Caps and Digitatas. I however, have only seen damage to my favorite Montipora Alsepta. No damage has been seen on any other Montis (and I have quite a few) until last week. I have now got some damage and have seen adult nudi's on the only Montipora close to the Alsepta, the Hirsuta.
Up till now, I've been manually removing or killing them during nightly (and daily) inspections. Every few days I remove the coral and go over the bare areas with a soft toothbrush to try to remove eggs and larvae. I think this, and possibly my wrasse, have kept the numbers down a bit and kept them at least on this one, and now two corals.
Obviously it isn't eradicating the problem and I am unwilling to lose all of my montipora without a fight.

So I contacted Mitch Carl, who told me that the treatment for these critters was the same doseage of Levamisole as for the very nasty Acro Flatworms.
Treatment will consist of: removing ALL affected and unaffected Montipora from the main tank. Once a week for four to five weeks dip all corals for six hours and place in Quarantine tank. Hopefully, Nudibranchs remaining in main tank will have starved.
I've got the 20Gal tank still up and empty, but am not sure I'll be able to fit them all, as I have some very large caps and some well incrusted on rocks. I'll use this as the quarantine tank if possible, haven't figured out what to use for dipping. I ordered the Levamisole yesterday.
I have some pics, before and after, of the damaged corals...and can continue to take them of the whole process if any of you are interested.

Redfish · Post by **Redfish** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 4:24 pm

Of course we are!

sb1227 · Post by **sb1227** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 7:24 pm

Here's a couple of pics. The first is a close up of damage after a couple of weeks, the second is the whole thing (bleached areas are mainly on encrusting areas, some on underside of branching areas). Third Pic was this coral about a year ago and getting color and growth. The white areas will eventually lose all tissue as you'll see in the pics of the Alsepta.

sb1227 · Post by **sb1227** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 7:38 pm

This one is much harder for me to look at. The first is, obviously, healthy. The second is a close up, same coral...massive damage. The tissue is completely gone in areas where you see algae (This was a real pain, though now almost all hair algae in the tank is gone, it still seems to want to grow here. Has to be removed often, as the little bastards hide under it). The third is the whole thing, but you really can't see the amount of damage. It's lost almost all tissue on the lower right quarter, as well as alot if the middle. I'm hoping, but not sure at all if this guy will make it in the end. It's been pretty hardy though. I find it interesting that these are two of the three wild Montiporas in my tank.

casey · Post by **casey** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 4:56 pm

Wow Sue that sucks im sorry I know how much you love your coral especially those please post any more pics and treatments you are doing so we can try to learn from you how to kill the Ba****** and pics of them if you can.Good luck kicken there butts.

sb1227 · Post by **sb1227** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 8:32 pm

Well, I got the Levamisole today, but won't be able to start the treatment until This weekend. Got the quarantine tank up and running. I think I'll use a ten gallon tank with 5 gallons of water for the dip, more space than a 5 gallon bucket. It will probably take a couple of times to get them all treated, I think this stuff lasts when mixed, so I am going to use the same water. I will change it each week for the new dip to be sure it's fresh.

Took the Alsepta out to brush it off yesterday. It looks rough, I like to keep any algae from overgrowing on the dead areas so I can see any Nudibranchs. I did notice something I found interesting, there were maybe 5 or 6 Asterina stars on the skeleton areas. I began to wonder if these critters would possibly eat the eggs or larvae of the Nudibranchs. From what little I know of them, they tend to be harmless, are good detrius cleaners and algae eaters. I've never seen them on any of the corals, and they were not on the live or even necrotic tissue on this one.
I wouldn't have been too surprised to see them on the necrotic tissue.

Fortunately I removed three small frags from this coral a few weeks ago, the tips that haven't been affected yet. They are doing well in the 40.

So sometime this week, I'll go to the nice Pharmacist and get some doses of 0.84g and start this thing. I almost think I might as well get a scale.

If I ever start seeing alot of the Asterinas, I'll box them up for Andy's shrimp.

Taking all of these corals out should give me a chance to do some cleaning in the tank, especially areas I haven't been able to get to. Moving some of the rocks might be a bit of a stress factor, it always seems that things will get broken.

casey · Post by **casey** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 8:38 pm

Thanks for the update Sue,please keep us posted on your progress and good luck with getting them all,I hope you dont break any corals good luck.

sb1227 · Post by **sb1227** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 10:43 am

Started the ordeal this morning. So far I have most of them out, the huge ones will have to go in the next batch. I took this opportunity to break the rock that the Danae and the Spumosa or Confusa (whichever it is, but I'm going to call it a confusa) were on, they were starting to get grumpy with each other. So needless to say....I will have some outstanding frags for sale after this month long treatment, I'm not going to even put them back in the main tank.
Taking all this out sure has left me some room to rearrange some of the bigger acros, they needed the water flow and now they have it.

I don't like moving acros once they're set, it does more harm than good. But after a few years growth, it'll be better for them to be placed a bit lower and into good water flow.
Still have to clean up a bit and do a water change, but not till after I get the huge caps out. I'll post a pic of the bucket of stuff I took out that isn't going to be worth trying to save. Shame, I had that one Digitata for 4 years. I did get some frags from it though.
I bet I'll have an algae bloom after this day....and it was all finally almost gone. But knowing my tank, it'll do this just to get back at me.

sb1227 · Post by **sb1227** » Sat Apr 08, 2006 9:27 pm

Ok, dip day number two is almost over. I haven't seen any sign of critters since the first dip. That's the good thing.
The bad thing is that the corals are definately starting to suffer from the change in lighting. I don't mind them losing a little color, but the confusa is looking like it has a bit of a case of low light bleaching. I put it thru the second treatment and then took the chance and placed it in the 40 Gallon. I hope to be lucky as this one hadn't been affected by the Nudibranchs, but moving it yet again may make it worse. At least it will have a chance. I also moved a frag of the Danae.

Just a note for anyone who hasn't had to deal with this: IT SUCKS.

casey · Post by **casey** » Sun Apr 09, 2006 9:09 am

wow Sue sounds like a pain,I know you will get it under control hang in there,I will come check out the new tank when you get it going.

sb1227 · Post by **sb1227** » Sat Apr 15, 2006 7:48 pm

Week three treatment is going on. Everything seems to be hanging in ok, although most of the corals have lost their color. Nothing like looking at a tank of brown Montipora.

Well, as I was brushing off the Alsepta, I think I found one of the Nudibranchs.

I'm not sure, but assumed it was one. I remember thinking the other day that it was still loosing tissue, maybe so. So I had to cut the branches. It has lost so much tissue it was bound to happen anyway. I also removed the Hirsuta from the rock it was encrusting.
FWIW, if any of you ever have to do this, and you have any Montiporas that have nooks and crannies, go ahead and break it to where you can get to it to remove either them or the eggs.

The ones in the 40 seem to be doing fine, the Alsepta frags I had in there are really getting green. They would color up real well under 15K to 20K lighting.

sb1227 · Post by **sb1227** » Sat Apr 22, 2006 9:08 pm

Did the fourth treatment...and won't do any more, unless I have to. At this point I'm going to say I really can't decide if this was a success or not.
Here's the latest tally:
Hirsuta-dead
Alsepta- came out with about 8 small frags, the rest is dead
Purple rimmed cap- was 6"x 8" now a few frags and a couple of bigger peices but it looks rough.
Purple cap- I think it will eventually be ok, has some light issues
5"x10" Orange cap- lost alot of it's color. I may have to break this just because I don't have any room for it.
Blue Polyp Danae- about 70 Percent of it is dead but has slight possibility it'll make it.
Confusa- I think this one had the least damage, and will be fine.
Digitata- 2 frags made it.
Part of me wishes I'd just left the unaffected corals alone. But I know eventually they would have gotten to them. I think I'll be beating myself up for a while over this though. It really broke my heart about the danae, and the hirsuta as these were both wild one's I'd been able to save from the LFS. The Alsepta I can't think about much. But the frags are doing well.

casey · Post by **casey** » Sat Apr 22, 2006 9:13 pm

Sorry for the losses Sue it is a heartbreaker,I sure hope things turn back around for you,thanks for posting your progress so we all can learn.

Redfish · Post by **Redfish** » Sat Apr 22, 2006 10:03 pm

Yeah, sorry to hear that. Now both of us can be in a funk.